Ed Sheeran joins Zane Lowe on Apple Music 1 for an in-depth conversation about exploring grief, depression, hope, and honesty on his new album ‘-‘ (pronounced ’Subtract’), which he calls his “most uncomfortable record”. He tells Apple Music about finding freedom in honesty and discusses fighting copyright lawsuits and why he would never consider litigation against a fellow songwriter.
He also opens up about making an album to process his grief, crying daily since the passing of his friend Jamal Edwards, embracing a healthier lifestyle since becoming a father, why he hates the idea of being the “sad pop star”, and how his friendship with Taylor Swift led to his collaboration with The National’s Aaron Dessner. “This is the best conversation I’ve had in ages,” he tells Zane. “This is f***ing great…some subjects here, people tell me not to talk about…”
VIDEO | Ed Sheeran Tells Apple Music About Exploring Grief and Depression on New Album ‘-‘, Finding Freedom in Honesty, Friendship with Taylor Swift, Copyright Lawsuits, and More
Ed Sheeran Tells Apple Music His New Album ‘-‘ Is The Most Human He’s Ever Been and His Most Uncomfortable Record …
I am who I am, and I’m definitely not a perfect human being. And I do make mistakes, but the album that I’ve made is about being honest. There’s probably stuff in this interview that’s going to be sensationalized and make headlines and…I hope people just see me as a human being and not a statistic crazed pop monster.
The reason I’ve cried during the interview is this is real life for me. This is stuff that I’m still going through, I’m still processing. And I feel like this record is definitely the most human that I’ve been. I hate it when artists go, “It’s my most personal record yet,” because I feel like each record I put out is super personal.
This is just more uncomfortable. I think it’s my most uncomfortable record. As I’m getting older, I’m getting less uncomfortable just being comfortable in my own skin, I guess, and not afraid what people think.
Ed Sheeran Tells Apple Why Releasing ‘-‘ is Foreign Territory to Him…
Aaron will tell you this, but he sent me seven instrumentals one day and I sent them all back in two and a half hours and we have all the time stamps on it. So it was like, and it’s songs like Sycamore, which is one of my favorite songs that I’ve… That’s what I find really uncomfortable about the release of the album is I have no idea.
It’s foreign territory for me… even with Plus or Multiply, it’s like you write for three years and you pick the best songs and then that’s the album. Whereas this one, I wrote for a month and all of those songs are coming out. There’s a bonus of the album with eight songs and that’s all that I wrote in that time. And it’s coming out.
And it’s not even necessarily a risk because it is what my fans originally liked me for, which was singer-songwriter stuff. Each my albums, I’ve always been like, well, I know I’ve got this and I know I’ve got this and I know I’ve got this.
Ed Sheeran Tells Apple Music About Making an Album About Grief and Depression and Talking It a Day at a Time…
I sent this record to the record label, and they were like, “Is it a breakup album?” And it’s not. It’s an album about… grief and depression and stuff. I feel that I don’t want to give too much context and hammer it home, because I don’t want people listening to Eyes Closed and be like, “This is about Ed’s friend that died.” I want people to listen to it and relate it to their own life.
One of the things that I realized most in making this record and feeling the way I felt throughout Cherry’s cancer diagnosis and Jamal dying, and the court case, and then Shane dying first day of the court case. Just all of these things like that, those days were horrible days. And then it gets to midnight and then the next day begins. And that’s either going to be another bad day or it might be a good day.
The thing about grieving or even anxiety about Cherry’s health or feeling depressed and stuff like that, none of that matters with your kids because they’re just like… I would go to bed crying, I’d cry myself to sleep after spending hours and hours at Jamal’s mural and I’d get in at two and I just remember just sobbing. And then waking up in the morning at six to your daughter being like, “Hey, let’s eat porridge.”
Ed Sheeran Tells Apple Music About Finding Freedom In Honesty, Fighting The Lawsuit, and Capturing What He’s Gone Through on His New Album…
Ed: The thing that it’s quite freeing is usually if we did an interview, there’d be things that I’d be like, I’m not going to talk about that because that’ll be sensationalized and go to a thing. And there’s something very freeing about being like, “Yeah, this is what’s f***ing going on, and I don’t care how people take it.
This is how I feel. This is what’s happened. This is what’s happened in my past.” And there’s something very freeing about just being honest. And what’s the worst thing that can happen? This is the thing, even with the lawsuit stuff. When people are like, “Don’t talk about it, don’t talk about it,” I’m like, “Why? What do you think my opinion is?
This is my opinion.” Obviously, I’m f***ing fighting it. Or my opinion on alcohol abuse or drug abuse or depression or stuff, this is it. This is it. This is how I feel. And I might not feel like that in five years’ time and things change, but this is it now.
And I think artists, we’re expected to be these, as you said, this
Zane: …Be grateful for the success you have… Ed: Totally. Mate, I am. See, I love it. I love getting on stage and singing songs, but with this album, it’s what I’ve gone through and I want people to listen to it basically, and I hope they do. Ed Sheeran Tells Apple Music How The Court Cases Have Impacted His Songwriting and That He Would Never Consider Litigation… Zane: Did the court case change the way that you approach songwriting? Even subliminally, you must hear things… And go, that sounds a little bit like this. Sounds a little bit like that. Ed: Totally. Yeah, yeah. All the time. All the time. Zane: Do you ever consider litigation or what’s your feeling on that now that you’ve been on the receiving end of that? Ed Sheeran: I would just never do it. I’d just never do it. I feel like if people felt that they had would come to me… And I’ve cleared songs for people that have come. There was a Rod Wave song where he used to sample of my song, U.N.I, and he came to me and cleared it. And that’s like, yeah. The thing with these cases, it’s not usually song writers that are suing song writers. I mean sometimes it is, but it’s not… I feel like in the song writing community, everyone sort of knows that there’s four chords primarily that are used and there’s eight notes. And we work with what we’ve got, with doing that. So I’ve even gone to artists to clear songs. I had a song that I wrote for Keith Urban and it sort of sounded like a Coldplay song. So I emailed Chris Martin and I said, “This sounds like your tune. Can we clear it?” And he went, “Don’t be ridiculous. No.” And on the song I made sure they put, “I think it sounds like Ever Glow, Coldplay, but he was just like, nah, I know how songs are written. And I know you didn’t go into the studio and go, I want to write this.” Ed Sheeran Tells Apple Music About His Friendship With Taylor Swift is Like Therapy and Credits Her For Suggesting He Collaborate with Aaron Dessner… Ed: I have long, long, long conversations with Taylor about stuff just because I feel like
She was the inspiration for it. She hooked me up with Aaron to work on Red (Taylor’s Version) to work on Run and Everything Has Changed. And then
Ed Sheeran Tells Apple Music He’s Cried Every Day Since The Passing of His Late Friend Jamal Edwards… He’s just the best. He’s the best. That’s the thing…That’s the thing. That’s what I was saying in the song, is everyone remembers him the way that the media are telling you to remember him. “He was a mogul, he set up SBTV, he was worth this, and he was worth that.” But he was just a really great, lovely, funny bloke, and that’s part of him, but who he was as a person was like… I’m going to get really f***ing upset man. I’m sorry. F***ing hell. I never cry, and all of the interviews, I seem to be crying. It’s just going to be like… Ever since he’s passed away, I cry every day. I like that I still feel this way. I think this is the most respectful way to feel about someone that you’ve lost, is actually allow yourself to feel rather than just bury it down. I hate it. I don’t want this to turn into some Ed cries every time that he talks about this album or whatever, but it’s real f***ing life. Ed Sheeran Tells Apple Music About Making an Album To Process His Grief… I played a show yesterday, and I went to a bar afterwards, and some of my fans from the show had ended up in the bar. I was talking to them, and they were like, “It’s weird. Grief is this really solitary thing that you are expected to grieve for X amount of time, and then get back to normal life and forget about it. It never happened. Why are you still sad 10 years on?” They were saying having a record about it justifies the living with it. Your life can fit around grief. You don’t have to get over anything. I will never, ever, ever get over Jamal dying at 31. I don’t want to, I don’t feel like I have to. I feel like, if I want to cry, I can cry. Yeah. But someone sent me a picture of a book
